Joy Reed invited former Republican National Committee chairman Michael Steele on Thursday to discuss how Donald Trump’s popularity within the Republican Party might affect other candidates.

“Michael, it hardly matters if he’s the candidate, because if he isn’t, whoever the candidate is, ‘Trump is still a great president,’ vowed to save Trump.” Because you have to,” Reid said. (Related: Black voters soften stance on Biden, turn to Trump in 2024 election: poll)

Steele agreed with his assessment, adding that candidates other than Trump would still “live in his shadow.”

.@Michael Steele On Donald Trump: “This has always been forever about ruling a new party that he can puncture first.” #the lead out pic.twitter.com/kIyw6A6uOl

— Leadout (@thereidout) July 28, 2023

“And that’s the other side of this story that no one wants to talk about. So you want to kick out DeSantis? Flop. Do you want to raise Tim Scott? Oh, I hope you understand,” said Steele.

“Okay, so what do you think this pro-Trump base is going to do?” And more importantly, what do you think Donald Trump himself is doing? Will he then say to his usurper, “Oh, this is my base”? take them. And I will help you become the next President of the United States,” Steele added.

“No, you can’t do that. It was always about controlling a party that you knew you could punk from the start,” said Steele.

Trump has a commanding lead over other candidates in the 2024 Republican primary. According to FiveThirtyEight, 53.8% of Republican primary voters support former President Trump. His arch-rival, Republican Florida Governor Ron DeSantis, fell to 15.5% of the primary vote. Vivek Ramaswamy has 6.8% of the vote, while former Vice President Mike Pence has 4.6%.